(no subject)

[dolorous_ett]

The only annoying thing about going to China for a month (YAY!!!) is that I'm going to miss A Dance with Dragons, and just by a couple of days. Very vexing - not that I feel Betrayed or anything silly like that, but I've been waiting for years for this, and I'm going to be spending a month dodging spoilers here. 

So, while I can still speculate as well as anyone else, I'd like to hear all your crackpot Song of Ice and Fire theories. To set the ball rolling, here are three of mine:

1. (the most controversial) Jon Snow is really, truly the bastard son of Eddard Stark and a commoner called Wylla. Why? Because Ned Stark said so, and he is truthful past the point of common sense. If Rhaegar and Lyanna Stark had issue, it's someone quite different, such as a minor character in the Night's Watch like Grenn or Satin, or perhaps Jeyne Poole.

 

2. There are too many magic horns in this story, none with really reliable provenance. Over the centuries, they have got mixed up. The Horn of Joramun really summons krakens, the kraken-summoning horn actually controls dragons and the dragon-controlling one is in fact the Horn of Joramun. Result: when the Horn of Joramun is blown nothing happens because Castle Black is landlocked and there are no sea monsters to hand. Similar non-results or chaotic results for the others. The moral is that magic isn't reliable if you want to get something really useful done.

3. "The Bear and the Maiden Fair" is a song about Ser Jorah Mormont and his inappropriate second wife.

Your thoughts?

Comments

[the-reda.livejournal.com]

When and where are you gonna be? I'm gonna be around all summer.

[dolorous-ett.livejournal.com]

About a month, arriving Beijing the 11th and leaving the 9th of August.

I don't think we'll be going very far except perhaps a few days in Beijing either end, because of the wee one. We're not quite sure how travel will work with a kiddie, and we don't want to take on too much.

Are you anywhere near Beijing? Message me if you want to talk in somewhere that's not an open post!

[nineveh-uk.livejournal.com]

I am really looking forward to catching up with the series, and then re-reading all the books plus the last one currently out that I was saving not to be annoyed because ADWD wasn't. I suppose GRRM isn't popular enough in China for you to pick up a pirate copy while there and buy the real one when you get back... Not that I would advocate that.

My question re. Jon Snow is why, if he were the bastard son of Lyanna, Eddard would disguise him as his own politically vulnerable bastard son, rather than just make up an orphaned cousin story rather less likely to result in, random example, "You are worth more than your legitimate brothers. Seize House Stark from Robb!"

[dolorous-ett.livejournal.com]

I suppose GRRM isn't popular enough in China for you to pick up a pirate copy while there and buy the real one when you get back... Not that I would advocate that.

Now you come to mention it, it's just barely possible that ADWD might be available in an expensive foreign-language bookshop somewhere in Beijing... but I'm not holding my breath.

My question re. Jon Snow is why, if he were the bastard son of Lyanna, Eddard would disguise him as his own politically vulnerable bastard son, rather than just make up an orphaned cousin story rather less likely to result in, random example, "You are worth more than your legitimate brothers. Seize House Stark from Robb!"

This is a good question, and the book hasn't answered it yet.

Possibly the idea is that, when forced to lie for the Greater Good, Ned Stark is actually a really, really poor liar?

[st-aurafina.livejournal.com]

2. There are too many magic horns in this story

Paging Doctor Freud!

3. "The Bear and the Maiden Fair" is a song about Ser Jorah Mormont and his inappropriate second wife.

This makes a disturbing amount of sense!

My only crack theory (or wild and unsubstantiated hope!) is that all the good people get together. So, Brienne and Arya can form an all-female militia of vigilante assassins and soldiers, and will clean Westeros up. Sam will finally get to study to be a Maester, and will figure out an amazing way to grow wheat in winter. Sansa will get the hell away from Littlefinger.

But what will really happen is that GRRM will give every character a number, and then roll dice to see who lives. So we can never predict it.

[dolorous-ett.livejournal.com]

Paging Doctor Freud!

Paging Doctor Sporfle!

My only crack theory (or wild and unsubstantiated hope!) is that all the good people get together. So, Brienne and Arya can form an all-female militia of vigilante assassins and soldiers, and will clean Westeros up. Sam will finally get to study to be a Maester, and will figure out an amazing way to grow wheat in winter. Sansa will get the hell away from Littlefinger.

I'd love it if all the nice people got together. There's really quite a lot of them, and the nasty people are now starting to kill each other off instead of go for the nice ones, so I suppose we have to live in hope...

It's true that no-one is genuinely safe in ASOIF. But that's one of the things that make it stand out, and I really wouldn't want to see that go.

While being completely smitten with the idea of Arya and Brienne roaming the landscape and PWNing everyone, of course...

[erised1810.livejournal.com]

oooh! eeeee! when is it coming out when is it coming out when is it not tat i even started the series yet but eh you'll never know.comign out?

[dolorous-ett.livejournal.com]

You'll love the series when you do start it! But A Dance with Dragons still isn't the last book in the series, so I can completely understand if you want to hold out until you can read the end as well as the beginning. It's certainly been a long wait.

The book comes out in the UK on July 12th - two days after I go to China!

[erised1810.livejournal.com]

I know. Iheard from others who had some kind of hysterical laughing fit once it was announced this last volume would be split into a trilogy. or something. at this point i'm starting to mix up the authors-with-ongoing-series who are still alive and the ones who passed away before the thing was done. i was thinking grrm was one of the ones who was still here though. you know, if you have any e-devices at all with you in chin i'd be glad to snapit fro mthe net somewhere and ping it your way. and now i'll duck before you put me on the scaffold for that-one...

[dolorous-ett.livejournal.com]

Last volume split into a trilogy? We've already had the second-last volume split in two - when will this madness end?

Tempting to take you up on your offer... but perhaps I should see whether a legit copy is available in Beijing first... thanks!

[lareinenoire.livejournal.com]

Hee, I love #3 and it makes a terrifying amount of sense. ;)

I just got to the bit in AFfC where Euron brings out the Strange Valyrian Dragon-Horn of Dooooooom (which I think is its proper name) and I think there is quite a bit to be said for #2. Too many magic horns cannot bode well for anybody, really. Although it would be hilarious if someone at Castle Black did blow what they thought was the Horn of Joramun and suddenly Pyke gets swallowed up by a giant kraken...

Re: #1, I did find myself following the references to Lyanna a lot closer on this most recent reread of the series, and it does seem as though GRRM is pointing to somebody being the bastard child of Lyanna and Rhaegar. Whether or not this is Jon is of course totally open to question, and there are so many bastard children running about in Westeros that it wouldn't surprise me if he pulled the metaphorical rug out from under everybody's feet and the mysterious Stark-Targaryen bastard did turn out to be Grenn or someone totally random.

It is a shame about missing the book! Any chance you might be able to get it shipped to China? It would be awful to get spoiled out of sheer bad luck...

I was planning to put together a squee/speculation post of my own after I finished AFfC (which might even be this week). At the moment, though, I have a few totally random theories that I rather like:

1. Sansa pwns Littlefinger. I admit, this is something that I really, really want to see because it would make me absurdly happy to see Sansa finally get her own back.

2. Melisandre vs. Dany's dragons. I've been wondering ever since my reread of AGoT whether Dany's dragons were hatched through the same kind of blood-magic that Melisandre is practicing (c.f. this essay about Mirri Maz Duur). The description of dead, lizard-like Rhaego really made me think about Melisandre's attempts to use fire sacrifices to bring stone dragons to life. This isn't so much a speculation as a random thought...

3. Arya finds Nymeria. Again, this is just something that I want to happen. I want Arya to have her wolf back, dammit!

[dolorous-ett.livejournal.com]

Although it would be hilarious if someone at Castle Black did blow what they thought was the Horn of Joramun and suddenly Pyke gets swallowed up by a giant kraken...

I would love it if that happens. Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of people either. I'd also be very amused at Euron's face when he blows the horn of DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM and the dragons completely ignore him.

Sansa pwns Littlefinger. I admit, this is something that I really, really want to see because it would make me absurdly happy to see Sansa finally get her own back.

I think this is very likely to be on the cards. GRRM has certainly made his readers want it badly after reading so far!

I'd like Arya to find Nymeria again, though it might take the edge off her completly-unattached assassin mentality.

[lareinenoire.livejournal.com]

Hee, unless it does summon the dragons, except they then eat him? ;) That would also be very satisfying.

Although nothing would be as satisfying as zombie!Catelyn Stark slowly roasting Walder Frey over an open fire. How is it that so many people have died horribly and he is still alive?!

I definitely think Sansa is going to have a major part to play in events to come. I must admit, there is also a part of me that just wants all the living Stark siblings back together again. Watching the series reminded me of just how awful it is that they're torn apart so quickly.

[dolorous-ett.livejournal.com]

Eaten by dragons or ignored by them, so long as Euron gets his deserts I'll be happy. And it probably is going to happen - he doesn't seem to have a long game plan beyond being evil and scary and cowing people to do what he wants.

Although nothing would be as satisfying as zombie!Catelyn Stark slowly roasting Walder Frey over an open fire. How is it that so many people have died horribly and he is still alive?!

It would be satsifying. One way or the other, he's sure to drop off his perch eventually, surely?

And Sansa is quietly learning quite a few tricks. Give her another five years and she will be a force to be reckoned with - especially as people like Cersei may not wise up to this until it is too late.

[snorkackcatcher]

On 1: I go with the Standard Theory, because I think GRRM simply underestimated the Fandom Effect: "Ha! I have cunningly worked this plot line into the story in a number of subtle but fair ways that will produce a shocking but satisfying twist when I reveal it! *reads forums* Oh. Shit."

Oddball theories that might happen: Littlefinger encounters UnCat and receives the most shattering blow of his life ... shortly before she orders him hanged for messing around with Sansa. And Arya turns really dark and ends up having to be offed by one of the heroes, possibly even Jon.

[dolorous-ett.livejournal.com]

I have to say that your arguments about the Standard Theory have an unnervingly plausible ring to them. But I'm still hoping for my version, just because I don't like Surprise!Royal Blood as a solution to plot problems.

Littlefinger encounters UnCat and receives the most shattering blow of his life ... shortly before she orders him hanged for messing around with Sansa.

I'd give good money to see that. Here's hoping!

[dolabellae.livejournal.com]

(deep breath, plunge back into LJ)

Hello! I love your theory 3 - and it has the benefit of being cheerful, since most ideas that come into my head about what might happen in the next book fill me with a creeping dread. Very worried about Shireen and her dreams of dragons, for instance. I am just concentrating on hoping that a large percentage of good people are still alive at the end of it, especially Brienne and Pod (and that both my favourite characters, who I regret can probably not be classified as good, manage the same feat.) I'd love to meet the Sphinx again but don't know if we're going to spend any time in Oldtown.

Re spoilers, had you heard that Amazon in Germany have messed up and sent out some copies of the book early? All the more reason to be very very careful around the internet for the next couple of weeks.

(and now after that public service announcement I shall slip away and see if I can work up the courage to make a proper post of my own. It's been ever so long since I was round here...)

[dolorous-ett.livejournal.com]

Hooray! You're still here! I've been wondering where you were and how you were... despite being a less than brilliant poster myself of late.

Yes, poor little Shireen. Who worries about Shireen? They should, as she appears to have a genuinely good heart, and those are in short supply.

And it would be great if Brienne and Pod make it through. My fingers are crossed, though I don't know if that will be enough.

I'd love to meet the Sphinx again but don't know if we're going to spend any time in Oldtown.

This isn't my theory, and annoyingly I can't remember whose it is, but someone on my f-list has come up with the idea that Alleras the Sphinx is Sarella the Sand Snake in disguise. Consider the names...

(and now after that public service announcement I shall slip away and see if I can work up the courage to make a proper post of my own. It's been ever so long since I was round here...)

I'd like to see that - though it may take a day or two for me to respond, as LJ time has been curtailed a bit of late. Hope all's well with you, anyway.

[a-t-rain.livejournal.com]

I hope I can get a copy of the book before I leave for Australia, because I can't think of anything more PERFECT for a 15-hour flight.

OK, crackpot theories: 1) Princess Rhaenys's black kitten, Balerion, grew up to be the old black tomcat Arya is chasing in AGoT; 2) Cersei is eventually going to be strangled by the Hand's gold chain o' hands.

[dolorous-ett.livejournal.com]

You're off to Australia? Lucky you! I hope it goes really well.

1) You could be right - it would be very GRRM for Balerion to still be about somewhere, and no longer cute.

2) Sounds plausible, though right now I think Tyrion would do his best to make sure he finished her off in person.

[dbassassin.livejournal.com]

Just saw this: yay for China trip! When are you going?